Old man alert. Nerd alert. EXTREME snoozefest alert. You’ve been warned, continue reading at your own peril!

originally posted in /c/technology but was removed quickly, presumably because it’s not considered a tech article or news. This is probably the better fit anyhow

For those who aren’t familiar with the Brave browser, its history and controversies, or Gecko engine vs. Chromium engine (and loosely, Webkit), it’s probably worth reading up on first. I’m writing this with the assumption that you know all of this stuff, because otherwise this post would be an even longer novel than it already is.

Brave recently released a paid version of their browser called Brave Origin which strips out a bunch of “features” like web3, AI, crypto, telemetry, etc.

It has a dedicated installer separate from the normal browser, except on mobile where the features can be batch disabled after verifying your license. You can also do it that way on the desktop version if you want to. Apparently a standalone android Origin app may be in the works, and the licensing system does seem to be relatively privacy preserving and not overly restrictive.

It’s pretty damn expensive (except for Linux where it’s free). And I must say that I feel like an outlier, because I strongly approve of this release and the direction I’m seeing the company take.

Let me state these right now:

  • Brave’s controversies are real and they were completely unacceptable and they are a permanent mark on their reputation. It’s no wonder many distrust them.
  • I’m fully aware that this still indirectly utilizes Google’s work, and that Google creates open source projects, pumps a ton of money into them, gets a ton of contributers on board, and then starts introducing proprietary blobs which handicaps competition while effectively squeezing free work and investment out of others.
  • I love FOSS with all my heart.
  • I could add a bunch of disclaimers but I’ll address them if I see something in the comments.

In a perfect world I would hate Brave’s decision. In our current reality I think it’s about the best move they could’ve made as a for-profit company outside of just creating their own browser engine. But there’s a reason there are so few options for engines right now, and it’s because it’s really fucking complex to make one and it takes a fuckload of time, money, and resources. When somebody develops a genuine engine contender, I’ll need to circle back.

Many of us use Firefox (or FF fork) with extensions. Many use ungoogled Chromium or other Chromoum forks. Obviously totally fine.

But there’s a few issues with the current browser space, as I see them.

First is that the reality is, much of the web now treats Chrome (rather, the Chromium engine) as a first-class citizen. Some sites run significantly faster or more reliably on Chromium. Some sites require Chromium to fully function. For example, want to use the GrapheneOS web installer? You need a Chromium-based browser. Chromium has lots of features under the hood that the modern web utilizes. If this has never been a consideration for you, then this particular point is moot.

Second is that data harvesting and tracking is becoming wayyy more advanced than even some techies might know about - and let’s be real, it’s becoming pretty fucking exhausting to keep up with the growing pile of bullshit being thrown our way. It’s also becoming harder and harder to stop. In both Gecko and Chromium you can, to varying degrees, install extensions, use browser forks, adjust settings, etc. to prevent much or even all of this. But the absolutely unfathomable amount of money being poured into violating your privacy needs hard, sustained, expensive work to fight in meaningful and new ways. One recent example I read about is brave implementing a new GPU anti-fingerprinting measure which is something I hadn’t even considered before.

Third is that the Internet of today is just straight-up busted. Yes there are super cool projects in the works such as I2P that are trying to change that. But they’re not reaching mass adoption any time soon. Most people can’t even bother trying to leave for places like Lemmy and that’s much less friction than I2P. I absolutely am not defeatist, and I fight this shit like the plague it is, but we also need to live our lives.

Fourth is that the way we use the internet varies. There’s a lot of things we could do to make sure we’re always maximally protected, but usually we find a balance. Stuff we daily drive, stuff we use when there’s a specific need, stuff we’re forced to use. If you’re hardcore enough to do things to the max at all times then you don’t even need to read this - you can browse in Mullvad Browser with (or without) a VPN or the Tor Browser, and supplement with OS and hardware privacy measures, etc… and you’re likely better protected for it. But for me, and I suspect for many others, in typical daily use we want the right balance of speed, usability, privacy, and security.

Those “features” that brave bundles in are really shitty. But the mass market time and time again shows they’ll put up with a lot of bullshit. And for most people you can just manually toggle the majority of these things off in the main browser for free, and it doesn’t take more than a few minutes. These features, like it or not, pull in a lot more money than what most non-profits get when solely relying on donations. Hell, one of the huge things keeping Firefox propped up is their search engine deal with Google, not the donations.

Brave, like it or not, does provide some pretty compelling value in other places. First and foremost it’s good to see people seeking out alternatives to Chrome for literally any reason. But they are admittedly super on-top of their Ad-blocking, anti-fingerprinting, other privacy features (like the shred tab button), and update cadence. They’re the closest thing to a well-funded Chrome competitor that, unfortunately for our reality, runs on Chromium.

I get that it feels wrong to pay to remove features from your browser. But you know what, I’m sick of the micro transaction ad filled privacy invading bulls hit joke of an economy the internet has accepted at large. If it were up to me I would bring back freeware and shareware. Brave is the modern day WinRAR in an alternate universe where 7zip wasn’t invented yet and the built in unzip still didn’t support other formats.

I’m going to continue using my Gecko based browsers as I always have. But for when I want or need something from Chromium, I think Brave Origin is my new go-to. For me that’s when I need certain hardware integration or I’m on a specific site, and chromium in my experience works very well with Android. One other thing I learned which to me is a definite plus, is that it was developed by the Ex-Ceo of Mozilla and creator of JavaScript (that was cool to learn, and that’s one guy btw, not two).

For those who think this I’m suspiciously positive about Brave, I get it. I literally thought of brave as spyware until I read about Brave Origin. I think it’s a sincere effort to correct course in a way that let’s them operate at the level they need to maintain their product. For most people reading this who feel like trying Brave, they should just spend 5 minutes adjusting the browser settings. If you’re clinically insane like me, and you actually resonated with this post, then maybe try it. And if you wanna buy it and chargeback or find a torrent or whatever, I don’t really care.

I suppose this post is solely about Brave if we lived in a vacuum. But actually I think it’s about sharing a mindset which I think can help the internet improve just a little bit, Brave or not.

Finally, let me end on a tangent about Alphabet Inc., mostly Google. That company is full of very smart sociopaths people who grabbed the internet by its collective ballsack, and while it may have felt good for a minute, they started squeezing them until you forgot what it feels like to have your balls flapping in the wind again. They made AOSP and then fucked us. They made Chromium and then fucked us. They did the heavy lifting for RCS and then fucked us. Google fucking sucks. And RIP to the word ‘googol’, you were robbed.

Honourable Webkit mention for Orion browser, and also their search engine Kagi which I fucking ADORE!

Tl;dr Brave Origin is alright, maybe try it, or don’t.

  • Taasz/Woof@lemmy.blahaj.zone
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    1
    ·
    21 hours ago

    I think using Firefox or a fork, and just degoogled Chromium if you need WebUSB is a better idea.

    So far I’ve never come across a site that doesn’t work in Firefox, a rare few need the chrome mask addon enabled, but it’s been awhile since I’ve had that happen.

  • Feyd@programming.dev
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    5
    ·
    11 days ago

    I don’t know how anyone can trust brave after the shit they pulled. They told us who they are. Believe them.

    • BrilliantBadger@piefed.ca
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      1
      ·
      11 days ago

      100%. It’s almost like we haven’t learned a single thing from the numerous examples of how we got here.

      I try to live by that same motto - when they show you who they are, believe them. Its never been wrong, and it won’t be with brave. Happily won’t be part of building them up.

    • stinkytofuisgood@lemmy.caOP
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      1
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      11 days ago

      Them earning my trust was pretty unexpected for me as well. It’s a rare thing for me to 180 on something like I did.

      Hopefully my trust is not misplaced. No doubt in my mind that they’ve permanently lost a huge subset of customers who would actually be very interested in what they’re doing otherwise.

  • JenitalJouster@lemmy.zip
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    3
    ·
    edit-2
    10 days ago

    i’m on iphone currently which i know isn’t ideal but im riding this device out to its death until i make the switch to grapheneOS. that being said even with the lack of alternatives you wont catch me using brave ever, the ceo is insane, and they just had too many controversies. that 60 bucks is better spent donating to any other FOSS project.

  • Rat_in_a_hat@lemmy.ca
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    2
    ·
    9 days ago

    Pay premium for a privacy focused browser? No.

    I’d rather build my own browser from scratch. What fucking world do we live in?

    Actually, I’d rather never browse the internet again.

    • stinkytofuisgood@lemmy.caOP
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      1
      ·
      9 days ago

      Never browsing the internet again is the real secret to happiness. It’s about a stone’s throw away for many of us who care deeply about it.

  • kestrel7_7@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    2
    ·
    11 days ago

    Dude. This is just ransomware with better marketing.

    If it spies on you until you pay the creator, that’s ransomware.

    • marcie (she/her)@lemmy.ml
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      2
      ·
      edit-2
      10 days ago

      I don’t really think it’s that simple. They currently have the best security focused AdBlock of any browser (built in rust, default to the browser, works on a higher level than ublock origin, immune to upstream changes like manifest v3, can clear persistent data for specific sites, has containerization modes for changing browser fingerprint on the fly). I’m hoping vanadium or ungoogled chromium (security nightmare btw even though it has no startup telemetry, but I do think it’s an interesting project for learning purposes) eventually adds brave shields to their browsers. The default settings aren’t great but the right settings config clears out all potential telemetry and phoning home.

      For what it’s worth, the grapheneos team agrees with me and considers brave to be the second best chromium browser after vanadium for security purposes 🤷‍♀️

      • kestrel7_7@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        3
        arrow-down
        2
        ·
        edit-2
        10 days ago

        Very secure ransomware with high utility-value is still ransomware.

        If it spies on you until you pay the creator, it’s ransomware.

        • Krudler@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          2
          ·
          10 days ago

          Please look up the definition of ransomware. This type of hysterical embellishment undermines your point.

    • typhoon@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      1
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      edit-2
      10 days ago

      Brave origin and the bloated one are open source. If you think is ramsoware, you can check the code, if you don’t have the skill look for the audit.

      May I ask which browser are you using?

  • BananaTrifleViolin@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    1
    ·
    11 days ago

    If youre willing to pay for a browser, donate that money to an OSS project that creates an actual private & secure browser.

    It is insane to give money to a company like Brave for a browser that removes the stuff they deliberately packed in to their core browser to track people and make money.

    At best what Brave are showing is that privately owned companies can’t make private secure browsers because they are profit motivated. The only way privacy can happen is to remove the profit motive entirely.

    • marcie (she/her)@lemmy.ml
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      1
      ·
      edit-2
      10 days ago

      Brave is a very secure browser with the correct settings. Grapheneos agrees with this take as well and consider it the second most secure chromium browser (though imo vanadium has it’s own shortcomings in regards to AdBlock, brave shields is very effective). Read my other comment for an analysis

      I wouldn’t pay for it because that deliberately destroys most privacy benefits. Origin is only worth it on Linux imo. Brave mostly takes advantage of tech illiterate people so the tech literate people can secure their privacy and blend in to a larger crowd. It’s not very ethical but they are the largest privacy browser as a result of being able to afford ad campaigns from this exploitation of illiteracy. I mostly dream of the day that someone forks it and makes it perfect on the backs of all their development money

      • stinkytofuisgood@lemmy.caOP
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        1
        ·
        10 days ago

        Surprisingly enough when using the Origin build of brave I saw no measurable difference in fingerprinting artifacts after reviewing the list from EFF’s Cover Your Tracks and browserleaks.com

        Your point about the Origin build reducing privacy via a smaller user pool was a huge concern for me, so those findings were a relief.

        Also yes, many will toggle settings such as ‘Ask not to track’ (forget the exact label), to on, or adding identifying, uncommon, and regional extensions (kinda any third party ones tbh) - believing that they’re increasing their privacy but unfortunately, significantly increasing chances of successful fingerprinting.

        I don’t blame people, it’s such a cluster fuck and the wisdom of old has drastically changed.

        • marcie (she/her)@lemmy.ml
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          1
          ·
          10 days ago

          Surprisingly enough when using the Origin build of brave I saw no measurable difference in fingerprinting artifacts after reviewing the list from EFF’s Cover Your Tracks and browserleaks.com

          I haven’t done a really big audit of the two yet to determine their differences in fingerprinting, but ostensibly its a different browser and has a much smaller userbase and it would be harder for you to hide your fingerprint. Linux is an even smaller subsect of a subsect and likely has only maybe a couple thousand users on Linux’s Origin. If you don’t care about that so much and stick to open source websites its not a very big deal if you’re just trying to avoid big tech algorithms.

          It is a pretty big browser at this point though. It is also generally more resilient to the shenanigans that websites pull to track you over other browsers due to their hardened containers between tabs. Firefox is a bad choice for this reason alone, the sandboxing is nearly nonexistent, even Tor Browser advises you to stick to one tab only. And for similar reasons, you should never install Brave through Flathub until Flathub-Next fixes the nested containerization issue that tampers with Chromium tab containers (170k people have done so regardless of this).

          • stinkytofuisgood@lemmy.caOP
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            1
            ·
            10 days ago

            Yeah, the result was weird to me too. I’ve been meaning to message the devs to get a concrete answer but I’ve been lazy.

            All the rest read, acknowledged and agreed.

            (for anyone reading this in the spooky future, we’re mainly discussing browser fingerprinting and other privacy technologies. Context matters, buckos)

  • Zerush@lemmy.ml
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    1
    ·
    edit-2
    11 days ago

    I’m happy with Vivaldi since over 10 Years and Zen as second, both European Browsers (Norway and Spain) which don’t sell my data and my soul. Ethics respect the user and transparency are very important for me and Brave don’t offer it, but shady business models. Thanks

  • w3dd1e@lemmy.zip
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    1
    ·
    11 days ago

    Brave owns an ad network and that’s all I need to know to never use any of their products.

    There are other comparable options that have better companies behind them.

    Kagi’s Orion has not given me a reason to hate them except that it isn’t open source. They don’t sell your data and they don’t serve ads.

    I can use uBlock on Orion,

    • milbyte@lemmy.ml
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      1
      ·
      6 days ago

      kagi has abandoned orion on linux and windows, and is open sourcing their codease. so, at least it is now? hope some brave volunteer will carry on with the vision.

      • w3dd1e@lemmy.zip
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        1
        ·
        5 days ago

        It’s a start! This is just the desktop browsers though. I don’t think they are opening up the mobile browsers.

  • lime!@feddit.nu
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    11 days ago

    interestingly, if your choice is to allow the stuff that calls home or pay to disable, that is illegal under the gdpr.

    also the founder is still a bigot so i don’t really want to give them money.

    • stinkytofuisgood@lemmy.caOP
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      1
      ·
      11 days ago

      Didn’t know that about the GDPR! That’s pretty interesting you’re right, haha. I wonder if they just don’t care to officially market in the EU. From my past limited business involving the EU it was a royal pain in the ass… I’m not complaining though, it’s just what you gotta comply with for the legal right to sell within it.

      I’m not gonna run defense for the founder lol, you’ve got a reasonable position obviously.

    • kestrel7_7@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      1
      ·
      11 days ago

      Yep, we already had a word for software that spies on you until you pay the creator—“ransomware.”

  • latetolemmy@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    11 days ago

    I’m not reading all that. Brave rocks. Firefox gargle balls. At least Brave has the guts to innovate and don’t sell out their holes to Google like Firefox.

  • enchantedgoldapple@sopuli.xyz
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    1
    arrow-down
    1
    ·
    11 days ago

    Appreciate your post very much. I used to use Brave as my primary browser a few years back but Lemmy basically guilt-tripped me into ditching it for Firefox even though it was working perfectly fine for me. Although now I have naturally grown accustomed to Firefox forks for my daily use, it’s nice to see that I’ll have another viable alternative if I ever need a Chromium browser.

  • miadidi@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    10 days ago

    I was using Firefox for 5 years and lately since few months, sites load terribly slower than on Brave Origin or Vanilla Chromium in Arch Linux for me atleast. A website that loads instantly on Brave takes like 5-10s on Firefox.

    I tried reinstalling Firefox, tried a very fresh install w/o any extensions or my bookmarks but it still felt very slow on two different devices and networks as well. Tried disabling ipv6—which improved the loading speeds by about 1-2s. But then I pulled the plug and completely switched to Brave Origin. TBH I love it. It’s snappy AF. Has none of Vanilla Bravd BS and has an adblocker as strong UBO.

    • anamethatisnt@sopuli.xyz
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      10 days ago

      Where do you find websites that takes 5-10 seconds for you to load on Firefox?
      Neither of the news sites, forums or self-hosted webuis I use take close to that. Even when I set disable caching and reload something heavy like the steam storepage I can’t get the browser to take 5 seconds to load it in.

      How do you feel about being a part of giving Google control over the whole browser ecosystem by using a Chromium based browser?

      • miadidi@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        0
        ·
        10 days ago

        Literally all websites are slower NGL. I wish that wasn’t happening but it is since the last few months and doesn’t seem to be getting better. I can’t use it in this state. I tried to find what’s wrong—using it in default state, disable and enable ipv6, enable and disable DoH, change my router DNS, change my Laptop DNS, Enable and Disable Extensions, Disable and Enable HW Acceleration, use various user.js (betterfox and arkenfox both), reinstalled Firefox with a fresh profile—but it’s still happening. I tried Librewolf as well and still the same issue. I can’t even submit an issue because there is nothing conclusive of what’s happening here. The only thing that is left is to reinstall the OS on both my systems. Switching to Brave Origin is much easier and fixes all the issues for me. So as much as I would like to use Firefox (because I love everything about it and want to support something other than chromium), it not usable for me especially when I have a relatively fast internet (250mbps) and strong and recent hardware.

        • anamethatisnt@sopuli.xyz
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          0
          ·
          10 days ago

          What part of a site loading is it that slows down to 5 to 10 seconds for you? What does the Network tab show?

          • miadidi@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            2
            ·
            1 day ago

            Sorry I was out for a vacation. Here you go.

            This is firefox

            This is Brave origin.

            Even though some things do load after 5s in brave as well, a website is instantly usable on Brave while Firefox takes the whole time to load it. The Firefox install above is a fresh one with just uBlock Origin. On Brave I have set it up to clear cache and browsing history on exit so nothing is being loaded from cache. No login used for the website tested in both browsers. On reddit as well usually, it takes Firefox around 12s to actually for it to be usable. While for Brave it is usually around 8s.

              • miadidi@lemmy.world
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                2
                ·
                21 hours ago

                Alright I got somewhere. It’s the DNS. Specifically my Adguard Home setup. By default it uses rate limiting of 20 requests per client. I removed it. And now Firefox is loading as fast as Brave was loading it previously.

                Although websites on Brave are still loading much faster, Firefox is now pretty usable. A few hundred ms difference is fine for me. The slowdown started happening since Firefox 150ish so probably something changed then that affected Firefox but Chromium based browsers worked fine. IDK what but for now removing rate limiting works for me. Hopefully my router won’t crash because of this. Thanks for the help. Also if I use Firefox DoH with custom Controld endpoint, everything loads at lightening speed. But I can’t use it as there are DNS rewrites in my Adguard Home which allows me to access my services w/o typing the IP all the time.

  • SocialistVibes01@lemmy.ml
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    11 days ago

    Brave is shitty defaults pulled by shitty people. It’s simple. I’ll never understand the appeal between Zoomers and Alphas. Lack of maturity, maybe? Are they also shitty people? Beats me.

        • stinkytofuisgood@lemmy.caOP
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          0
          ·
          11 days ago

          Hey man, I appreciate the input but firstly I don’t see how the generation of people applies in this case in any meaningful way.

          I can understand being frustrated with shitty aspects of the hyper-capitalistic society many of us live in and predatory nature of the modern free-market. But if you wanna make a difference please try expressing it in a way that encourages discussion and unity, rather than dissuade it.

          Per your username, I’m all for socialist vibes. My wish is more of a transition into a true socialist democracy, which isn’t ‘pure’ socialism per se, but we’re on the same team. In fact, the working class is on the same team. But man, you’re not giving off socialist vibes imo, and that’s the opposite effect that your username implies.

          Just my thoughts.

          • SocialistVibes01@lemmy.ml
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            0
            ·
            11 days ago

            lol, socialists don’t want to accommodate capitalism but overthrow it instead

            the working class potentially is on the same team but some are jailing already oppressed people in concentration camps, others are relying on that and many are egotistically snoozing through all of that and no gullible liberal talk about unity without conflict to make such unity possible is serious. Liberals shouldn’t call themselves socialist.

            • stinkytofuisgood@lemmy.caOP
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              0
              ·
              11 days ago

              Fight for what you believe in. I would be a hypocrite to tell you otherwise. I’m just saying, you’re not likely to win any support for a cause if you aren’t able to show people that they’ll be more accepted within a new system.

              It’s fine to disagree on semantics or ideology but you need the people who are fed-up to be on your side if you want the numbers to create any sort of viable movement.

              I get it, it’s frustrating, it’s slow, there’s infighting. It’s not to say your approach is wrong, just that the environment we were thrust into requires quite a bit more tolerance and understanding of those outside of your ideology, that is, if you want to do something more than argue with each other.

                • stinkytofuisgood@lemmy.caOP
                  link
                  fedilink
                  arrow-up
                  1
                  ·
                  11 days ago

                  I do advocate for them. Not that I am obligated to prove it to you on any way, but here’s a link of me commenting on Lemmy 8 months ago, in direct relation to First Nations peoples.

                  You can’t build good faith with people when you don’t give good faith arguments. Perhaps it’s worth contemplating if you’re really trying to change something in the world, or if you’re just frustrated and venting on the internet.

                  Either is fine, but let’s be honest with ourselves. Your comments lead me to believe you may be in the latter group.

  • Jo Miran@lemmy.ml
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    11 days ago

    I am a Firefox & forks diehard, but I need a Chromium/Webkit/Whatever based browser for a lot of corporate shit I have to access. So, I bit the bullet and bought Brave Origin. It doesn’t suck. I wouldn’t pick it as my main, but it’s fine. Much better option than Chrome and Edge, that’s for certain.

        • im_fine_sandy@nord.pub
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          0
          ·
          11 days ago

          That’s just because Brave tells websites that you’re using Chrome.

          All http requests include a “user agent” where the requester tells the server what agent the user is using. requesters can specify whatever they want - it’s not complex to tell the server you’re using tea leaves to render the server’s response.

          Some web pages are designed to tell the user that their browser is not compatible, if it doesn’t match a set of compatible browsers. So if you say you’re rendering the page with “tea leaves” it will tell you it’s not compatible because it doesn’t match “chrome” or “edge” or whatever.

          The outcome is - these alerts are rudimentary and not actually considering the capabilities of your browser.

          I generally use librewolf but as you say some pages are just broken, so I use ungoogled chromium for those pages.

          • stinkytofuisgood@lemmy.caOP
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            0
            ·
            9 days ago

            As with so many problems of the modern internet, the problem often comes down to Google’s greasy balls leaving stains in every nook and cranny of the web.

              • stinkytofuisgood@lemmy.caOP
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                1
                ·
                edit-2
                9 days ago

                Maybe, maybe not. Google knows how to manipulate the standards used on the web. My comment wasn’t really an assertion of fact as much as a dream of Google and their scummy practices dying

  • artyom@piefed.social
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    11 days ago

    Brave is not perfect but it does objectively have some privacy features that other browsers simply don’t. Like syncing devices with a passphrase (no account), and it’s also the only browser I’m aware of that has and continues to develop browser fingerprinting protections.

    • im_fine_sandy@nord.pub
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      11 days ago

      Doesn’t Firefox have fingerprinting protections which are disabled by default? LibreWolf enables them by default.

      • artyom@piefed.social
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        0
        ·
        11 days ago

        A lot of them claim this but I’m yet to see it. Most “fingerprinting protections” involve just having everyone using the same stats and trying to blend in. Brave does this by randomization instead, which is far more effective. They also just released GPU randomization. Orion claims to this day that fingerprinting resistance is impossible, which is preposterous because Brave is doing it today.

        https://brave.com/privacy-updates/38-webgl-webgpu-fingerprinting-protections/

        • im_fine_sandy@nord.pub
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          0
          ·
          11 days ago

          Brave does this by randomization instead, which is far more effective.

          Randomisation isn’t necessarily more effective, it’s just a different strategy.

          Orion claims to this day that fingerprinting resistance is impossible, which is preposterous because Brave is doing it today.

          I think you mean Orion is saying RFP is ineffective, and whether Brave’s implementation is or is not is a question of semantics.

          Like most security measures, each decision is a trade off between security and usability. The Firefox / LibreWolf / TOR implementation is fine for most users:

          https://wiki.mozilla.org/Security/Fingerprinting#Terse_List

          • stinkytofuisgood@lemmy.caOP
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            0
            ·
            9 days ago

            We’re kinda stuck between a rock and a hard place in terms of fingerprinting, at least for now.

            I was typing out my explanation but I started writing too much and I suppose if you’re interested in the technical details you can Google it look it up.

            As with all this stuff, it’s a bottomless pit. Are you sure you really wanna jump in?

            • im_fine_sandy@nord.pub
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              0
              ·
              9 days ago

              With the greatest respect, I already know as much as I wish to on this topic and do not wish to compare our differing opinions at this time.

              • stinkytofuisgood@lemmy.caOP
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                1
                ·
                9 days ago

                It was a hypothetical question posed to the readers haha

                But that’s a super polite way of rejecting somebody, so props for that 😂